Page 3 of 7 FirstFirst 12345 ... LastLast
Results 21 to 30 of 65

Thread: Billy Garrett, Jr - DePaul

  1. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by TheSultan View Post
    No Jerel McNeal isn't better than those guys. When have I ever said that someone who scores the most is a program's best player?

    And no, Nukem isn't right. Billy Garrett isn't that good - he is in fact quite average. I have evidence that at least backs my case. You have nothing except your eye test - and I don't think he is really all that good when watching him. He is simply the best player on a bad team.

    And by the way, your phrase "why bother to play the games if stats are the only measure" is nonsensical. If you don't play the games, then stats don't exist. And stats don't tell you everything, but they tell you a lot more than the eye test tells you.
    Why do coaches watch recruits then?

    Really, your argument is part true and part silly. Holding it as gospel is absurd. The Garrett I saw on De Paul, I would not want. I saw, though, that he had talent and I saw he was not properly coached. I never saw any great improvement from his first year to his senior year. Is that all due to he being a bad player or poor coaching? I have seen some talent not develop at De Paul, so I believe it is the latter. He is someone that I feel could have been coached and developed into a good team player. A stud? no. A guy I want to take the majority of the shots? no. But he had talent that was misplaced on a very bad team. He was the team without a team around him. I believe he is a different player with better talent around him. Now, can I point to any statistic to help you understand? He!! no, it doesn't exist, because he was the best player for 4 years on an awful team. That does not mean, though, that the statistics translate to a different program. That is the point others have made, but you sit on the statistics so hard that you cannot see beyond them.

    I am fine that he chose De Paul, but would have liked to have seen him develop in a different program where he could better be utilized.

  2. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by TheSultan View Post
    I doubt it unless you are talking about a 8th or 9th guy.

    When you are high usage players like Garrett and Cain, and are 10th and 11th on a bad team in eFG%, you simply aren't good players. There is zero evidence to suggest otherwise. At least I can SHOW you evidence to back up my assertion. You simply cannot.
    Most people with basketball evaluation skills beyond looking at metrics would agree that Billy Garrett Jr would be an ideal player on a team as a 3rd or 4th option, not a #1. You sound foolish saying he would be an 8th or 9th guy on a good D1 team. His shortcomings statistically have come because he is the focus of every team's scouting report. If you stopped him #1 and Cain #2 you won. If you don't think a player can actually look like 2 completely different players depending on the talent around them, please explain the difference in Nigel Hays' play as a sophomore when he played with Kaminsky and Dekker as a 3rd/4th option, compared with being the #1 option the last 2 years. There is no way on God's green earth you can say he was better this year, statistics be damned, yet he looked like a surefire 1st round pick as a Sophomore. Now praying to be drafted at all.

  3. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by MUMac View Post
    Why do coaches watch recruits then?

    Really, your argument is part true and part silly. Holding it as gospel is absurd. The Garrett I saw on De Paul, I would not want. I saw, though, that he had talent and I saw he was not properly coached. I never saw any great improvement from his first year to his senior year. Is that all due to he being a bad player or poor coaching? I have seen some talent not develop at De Paul, so I believe it is the latter. He is someone that I feel could have been coached and developed into a good team player. A stud? no. A guy I want to take the majority of the shots? no. But he had talent that was misplaced on a very bad team. He was the team without a team around him. I believe he is a different player with better talent around him. Now, can I point to any statistic to help you understand? He!! no, it doesn't exist, because he was the best player for 4 years on an awful team. That does not mean, though, that the statistics translate to a different program. That is the point others have made, but you sit on the statistics so hard that you cannot see beyond them.

    I am fine that he chose De Paul, but would have liked to have seen him develop in a different program where he could better be utilized.

    Coaches watch recruits because high school stats don't translate to college. So yes, the eye test matters when scouting players.

    Regarding your second paragraph, I don't disagree with much of it at all. I don't know if Garrett didn't evolve into a better player because he just isn't as good as advertised or because of poor coaching. (Or due to his illness.) But the question I have is...does it matter? If we are judging him as a college player, we only have to go on what he produced. Not *why* he turned out that way.

    Now if I were an NBA scout, you would take a look at those numbers but also scout him in person. To see if skills translate to the next level.

  4. #24
    Wow. Garrett is a good player on a bad team. Quite simple.

  5. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by TheSultan View Post
    Coaches watch recruits because high school stats don't translate to college. So yes, the eye test matters when scouting players.

    Regarding your second paragraph, I don't disagree with much of it at all. I don't know if Garrett didn't evolve into a better player because he just isn't as good as advertised or because of poor coaching. (Or due to his illness.) But the question I have is...does it matter? If we are judging him as a college player, we only have to go on what he produced. Not *why* he turned out that way.

    Now if I were an NBA scout, you would take a look at those numbers but also scout him in person. To see if skills translate to the next level.
    Why would an NBA scout take a look at him in person? "He is simply not a good player."

  6. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by MUAlphaBangura View Post
    Why would an NBA scout take a look at him in person? "He is simply not a good player."

    Well DePaul has to play other teams with good players at times right?

  7. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by TheSultan View Post
    Well DePaul has to play other teams with good players at times right?
    Guess you are missing the point. Sigh.

  8. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by Nukem2 View Post
    Guess you are missing the point. Sigh.
    There's definitely a point being missed, but not by Sultan. Garrett is trash. He is emblematic of why DePaul sucks. He is overrated by Marquette fans that ignore tangible numbers because he hit a game winning layup against us once upon a time. But as a player, his greedy shots, his piss poor efficiency, that's why DePaul has sucked. Billy Garrett wouldn't play for Nova. Please. He plays for DePaul because they don't have better options. They are the only Big East team that can say that. Would he even start for anyone else?

    He's got the second worst eFG% on his team. He's a bad rebounder. He's just not good. And mercifully, his career is over. Good riddance to bad rubbish.

  9. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by Alan Bykowski, "brewcity77" View Post
    There's definitely a point being missed, but not by Sultan. Garrett is trash. He is emblematic of why DePaul sucks. He is overrated by Marquette fans that ignore tangible numbers because he hit a game winning layup against us once upon a time. But as a player, his greedy shots, his piss poor efficiency, that's why DePaul has sucked. Billy Garrett wouldn't play for Nova. Please. He plays for DePaul because they don't have better options. They are the only Big East team that can say that. Would he even start for anyone else?

    He's got the second worst eFG% on his team. He's a bad rebounder. He's just not good. And mercifully, his career is over. Good riddance to bad rubbish.
    Holy Toledo. What else can one say.

  10. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by Nukem2 View Post
    Holy Toledo. What else can one say.
    Eye test, stats, whatever. Just answer if he's really good enough to be a rotation player for Nova. Or us for that matter. No freaking way.

Page 3 of 7 FirstFirst 12345 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •