What will Junior's legacy be?

A month give or take left in his career, more NCAA wins in the past 35 years than every other point guard to be a part of Marquette basketball, except for TD's one year run, with one post-season left. A fairly clutch player who has come up big in a lot of key games, but who has thrown up just as many stinkers in key games. Has never really made a huge jump in skill year to year or added much noticeable to his game. His outside shot has become serviceable when wide open, but he hasn't become a consistent 3 point threat. I can't think of another player who has been a part of so many great wins, but who's legacy is still up in the air this late in their career.

Right place right time point guard with no better options available or just a big winner with flaws in his game?

Right or wrong, I think the next month will dictate his place in the MU point guard hierarchy. Another S16 or E8 (or winning out and getting a share of the big-east championship) and it will be hard to argue against his value over the past 4 years. At the least, he would be in the discussion for best PGs in the past 35 years because of post-season wins. If we fizzle out and exit in our 1st NCAA game, I think people (including me) will try to forget about him as fast as they can say Duane Wilson.

He didn't really play as a frosh and was a bit player really as a soph. Last year he was a key part but DJO and Jae were clearly the headliners.


I see him as a big winner with flaws in his game. I don't think he will ever go down as one of the best PGs in the last 35 years no matter what he or the team does the rest of the way. No way he will be remembered as being better then Smith,Miller,Hutchins, Diener, or DJ and I think most would put him behind Henry as well. All of those guys played in the last 30 years.

I appreciate Junior and he has had some big games for us but we have had some really good point guards over the years.

Junior's turnover issues this year are perplexing. I don't remember him having so many bad turnover games last year (the only one I remember off the top of my head is the Louisville game in the BET). I don't have Pomeroy access, but I'm assuming his TO% is considerably higher this year than last year.

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Originally Posted by Markedman

He didn't really play as a frosh and was a bit player really as a soph. Last year he was a key part but DJO and Jae were clearly the headliners.


I see him as a big winner with flaws in his game. I don't think he will ever go down as one of the best PGs in the last 35 years no matter what he or the team does the rest of the way. No way he will be remembered as being better then Smith,Miller,Hutchins, Diener, or DJ and I think most would put him behind Henry as well. All of those guys played in the last 30 years.

I appreciate Junior and he has had some big games for us but we have had some really good point guards over the years.

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I wouldn't call him a bit player as a sophomore. He averaged almost 20 mpg. But honestly, he just hasn't improved and lived up to the expectations placed on him. And kneel, if you compare game logs from this year and last, it looks about the same.

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Originally Posted by TheSultan

I wouldn't call him a bit player as a sophomore. He averaged almost 20 mpg. But honestly, he just hasn't improved and lived up to the expectations placed on him. And kneel, if you compare game logs from this year and last, it looks about the same.

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That's what I get for going off of memory.

I don't have access either but we are playing at a slower pace and his turnovers per game are the same and he is playing 1 less minute per game then last year....so I think his TO% must be up at least slightly.

Sultan...I guess 19.8 minutes a game is slightly higher then I expected ......but if your point is Derrick Wilson is more of a bit player type then Junior was as a Soph I have no argument with that.

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Originally Posted by kneelb4zerg

Junior's turnover issues this year are perplexing. I don't remember him having so many bad turnover games last year (the only one I remember off the top of my head is the Louisville game in the BET). I don't have Pomeroy access, but I'm assuming his TO% is considerably higher this year than last year.

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Originally Posted by TheSultan

I wouldn't call him a bit player as a sophomore. He averaged almost 20 mpg. But honestly, he just hasn't improved and lived up to the expectations placed on him. And kneel, if you compare game logs from this year and last, it looks about the same.

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Not if you look at his scoring lines. He's been a far better scorer this year. His season high last year was 15, he met or exceeded that 6 times this year. He didn't score in double figures 6 times all of last year (he's done it 12 times total this year).

answer me these two questions:

1. where does JC rank in NBA players played with in MU history?

2. where does JC rank in BEast PGs for this season?

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Originally Posted by brewcity77

Not if you look at his scoring lines. He's been a far better scorer this year. His season high last year was 15, he met or exceeded that 6 times this year. He didn't score in double figures 6 times all of last year (he's done it 12 times total this year).

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kneel was specifically speaking about turnovers. That is the only stat I was looking at.

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Originally Posted by bleedbluegold03

answer me these two questions:

1. where does JC rank in NBA players played with in MU history?

2. where does JC rank in BEast PGs for this season?

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1) Junior has had the good fortune of playing with NBA players but you can use that as a crutch as to why his scoring #s are so low.

2) Using the list below...I'd take JR ahead of DePaul, Rutgers, South Florida, Seton Hall and St. John's PGs.

Cincinnati--Cashmere Wright
Connecticut--Shabazz Napier
DePaul--Worhill Clahar (Brandon Young is a 2)
Georgetown--Markel Starks
Louisville--Peyton Siva
Marquette--Junior Cadougan
Notre Dame--Eric Atkins
Pittsburgh--Tray Woodall
Providence--Vincent Councill
Rutgers--Seagers/Mack/Carter
Seton Hall--Aaron Cosby
South Florida--Anthony Collins
St. John's-Phil Greene
Syracuse--Michael Carter-Williams
Villanova--Ryan Archandiacano

Here's how I would summarize his legacy...

No one is thinking back and wishing that Junior had redshirted his Frosh year.

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Originally Posted by AlexJesswein

Here's how I would summarize his legacy...

No one is thinking back and wishing that Junior had redshirted his Frosh year.

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Alex, honestly, I thought the very same thing a couple days ago.

Next year many MU fans may well be wishing that Junior had red-shirted.

If Duane Wilson/Dawson are not quite ready, and Derrick is running the show, a lot of the Junior-bashers may find themselves longing for the good old days.

Junior played 38 minutes against a top 10 team and had 1 turnover. I would take that any day.

Agree with Phantom and IWB. Sure Junior has his flaws, just look at the Cuse NBA guys last nite...! 2 Sweet 16s and a solid NCAA berth this year. Cannot do that without a pretty good PG. Love Junior, warts and all.....

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Originally Posted by AlexJesswein

1) Junior has had the good fortune of playing with NBA players but you can use that as a crutch as to why his scoring #s are so low.

2) Using the list below...I'd take JR ahead of DePaul, Rutgers, South Florida, Seton Hall and St. John's PGs.

Cincinnati--Cashmere Wright
Connecticut--Shabazz Napier
DePaul--Worhill Clahar (Brandon Young is a 2)
Georgetown--Markel Starks
Louisville--Peyton Siva
Marquette--Junior Cadougan
Notre Dame--Eric Atkins
Pittsburgh--Tray Woodall
Providence--Vincent Councill
Rutgers--Seagers/Mack/Carter
Seton Hall--Aaron Cosby
South Florida--Anthony Collins
St. John's-Phil Greene
Syracuse--Michael Carter-Williams
Villanova--Ryan Archandiacano

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I would also take Junior over Archandiacano (at least senior Junior vs. freshman Arch) and Vincent Council (the definition of a stat accumulator on a bad team).

I'll remember him at the more micro level. Over his career on those offensive possessions where the shot clock is ticking away and no one is willing or able to take a shot he more than often would take it upon himself to take it to the basket from way above the key - regardless of whether he was on the left or right wing - and navigate his way through traffic and seemed to me more often than not hit pay dirt - either all the way to the basket or more recently pull up for a floater. It started with the BE tourney game against WVU. He's gotten to be a more than reliable FT shooter which is very important for a point. Can you imagine how many more points DJ would have had if he was half-way serviceable from the FT line?

One area that I didn't see progression was his "drive and dish" game. From his early reviews I thought he was going to be in the mix with the best of MU's in that department - Lloyd Walton, Mandy Johnson and Doc Rivers (when he was playing point - a position where should have been playing since day one IMO).

However, if MU did redshirt him I think he would be really dangerous and valuable for MU next year IMO.

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Originally Posted by Jim Ganzer, "IWB"

Junior played 38 minutes against a top 10 team and had 1 turnover. I would take that any day.

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Yea...looking at one game is nice. Too bad his A/TO this year is 1.6.

I give Junior high marks for "attempting" to help his team by coming back after his achiiles injury when he was a freshman. However, I will always remember him for "the shot heard round the world" at the buzzer against UCONN on New Year's Day. It set the tone for our 2013 Big East season, IMO. If he hadn't hit that remarkable shot to force OT; we would have been in the Big East hole, right off the bat.

if you can't even rank a player in the top 1/3 (more like 1/2) of his conference for his senior season, he doesn't have a legacy in my mind from a career perspective.

we sugar coat it because he's "our player" and "Buzz's guy" but he is what he is: a "game manager" (fall back title given to a PG who doesn't do anything particularly well) who was most of the time serviceable, commonly below average and sometimes fantastic, lead guard.

Ahh the dreaded "game manager" label.... In my mind his performance is too up and down to be given that label. His great games, he performs at level with the best of the Big East pgs. His bad games, he performs at the level of the worst of the Big East pgs. He more fits into Jay Cutler's role as a poor man's Brett Farve type gunslinger, than your Kyle Orton, Alex Smith types.

Seriously if he closes out this season on a tear and gets us a share of the Big East title and a S16 run, he will have a career basically unmatched from a winning perspective. Also Travis, Hutch, Cordell never played the schedule that Junior has played. Over his 4 year career the Big East has been basketball's version of SEC football. Hard to say what those pg's would have done against this level of competition. While Dominic was legendary at man-man defense, he never got a s16, and had his own offensive flaws. He improved defensively, but you could argue he regressed offensively over 4 years.

Imagine Dominic playing for Buzz for four years.....