Printable View
In addition to everything else I believe and fear about this situation, this is EXACTLY right.Quote:
Originally Posted by uwm97
If you were going to pull the pin now, why wouldn't you hire someone with a proven track record as a head coach, as the A.D. stated in her press release announcing Rob's termination?
In fact, I have plenty of good friends who have long pushed for this move who won't be happy with the hire.
This just doesn't pass the look or smell test.
It doesn't make any sense to me whatsoever. It'd be perhaps different if the guy was with a specific coach for five or 10 years - Webster's bounced around about as much as as a guy could his age. That makes me skeptical. And again, what's his coaching style? CAN he coach? It's mind-boggling.
If you were going to do this, Billeter or Miller was the logical move.
They weren't bringing in a white guy as the next coach.
I'f race played any part in either including or excluding the coaching decision, everyone involved should be immediately fired, from the chancellor on down.Quote:
Originally Posted by MU/Panther
In the political correct world that some want to move in, race is a factor. Not that I said the I'm going to on wash my mouth out with soap.
Personally I hope we do hire an AA coach. There are plenty who are highly qualified. The only question is whether we will hire the right guy. Since we are clearly looking at a B-list of applicants that will be a crapshoot.
Fire, aim, ready. It's the Milwaukee way.
"I thought you said you was bringin' a white boy home! I don't see a white boy! I see a damn fool!"Quote:
Originally Posted by MU/Panther
Scott Nagy, at no point, was a candidate for Milwaukee. That should tell you everything you need to know about the coaching search.
Tracy Webster is fine. Lavall Jordan is fine. Billeter is fine. This is a good list. There are just going to be question marks with all the candidates because the pool of potential coached isn't the level that it could have been. Why? I think everyone knows that by now.
Instead of a coach who is a proven winner over a sustained period of time at a lower level (low-major or lower division), you have question marks.
That's fine - I think these guys are all good coaches. But if the point was to hire someone who would be obviously better than Rob Jeter, this pool doesn't fit the bill. Scott Nagy would have been there.
I also wonder who would work for the lower salary? I know some of these high-major assistants are making more than they would as head coach here.
All in all, I will likely be happy with the hire. I just don't expect the fans of this program to be happy; you fire Rob Jeter because you've got an ace up your sleeve. You don't fire Rob Jeter to bring in someone with question marks.
It's fairly obvious that the handling of the Rob Jeter firing adversely affected this search; apart from salary (we don't know what the new coaches will make), the Wright State job has a practice facility and a bigger in-arena fan base. Milwaukee has the potential roster - potential because all of these kids are giving the next coach a chance - to be much better than Wright State, which is going through an off season roster turnover like ours from spring 2006. They have a lot of their talent graduating.
This is the result. Untested assistant coaches or former/current head coaches with marginal or fleeting success.
If it really is Webster, I can't honestly be more disappointed or less surprised.
The people that run this university can't help themselves when it comes to sucking Madison's hind tit.
Webster has had no association with the UW for over 20 years. There are a lot of problems with this coaching change, but that would be absolutely the least of them.
If it is Webster, and the roster stays as is, if he does not have 20 wins and at least reach the Horizon League Tournament Semifinal, is the season a disapointment? The bar was set in the firing....doesn't he need to reach that level at a minimum?
And I really do not want to hear about "not his team" or other excuses.
When you fire someone, you do so because the next guy up is better, and he should produce immediately. You do not fire someone to hire the same, or worse.
Thoughts?
I think that would be unfair to Webster (or whoever the next coach is). But you'll see who in our community is full of **** - because they'll be heaping all the accolades on the successor if he wins, saying 'not his fault' if he loses.Quote:
Originally Posted by TheDarkHawkReturns
Remember, this is Amanda Braun's guy now. Her job is tied to his. So she's going to pull out all the stops to prove that she was right to fire Jeter and hire the new coach. I mean if she doesn't, it's going to be real easy to see she's the problem.
If it is Webster - I don't think disappointment is the word I'd use to describe the hire....it would be frustration. Seems like the exact same thing we did with Jeter and the end of his tenure was as ugly as it could be. Like others have state, this is totally on Braun and for her to do a RJ 2.0 is actually infuriating and makes zero sense.
Any of the other names floating around would make more sense...this hire would just seem odd...and smells of something fishy...
If Tracy is hired I doubt there's anything fishy about it at all. I think it just shows what the candidate pool was like. Amazingly, a program facing a firestorm of criticism in a state system choking down budget cuts with angry donors fleeing and an AD who just fired a highly respected guy in the coaching community -- in a one-bid league -- is not exactly considered a plum opportunity! Who knew?
I emphasized the one-bid issue because putting aside the horrendous mess the AD made of Rob Jeter's firing, that factor looms very large right now. Any coaching candidate out there probably watched Valpo in the NIT and OU in the Vegas and asked himself "why aren't these teams in the NCAA tournament?" Good question with a simple answer: it's because we are in a league that has descended to the point of near irrelevance. While our commissioner cuts pizza deals to bury the conference tournament in an empty wreck of an arena in the region's least attractive city, the member schools have received no help whatsoever in tackling the issue that is really holding us back: scheduling!
I agree with you. Which is why I think the other names that have been floating around (Billeter and Miller in particular) make much more sense because of the issues you raised. Wouldn't a coach from D2(3) that is itching for a D1 job be more willing and enthused to take a job such as ours? and wouldn't our AD be inclined to seek a coach such as that? One that would bring an energy and passion to the program because it's a chance to prove themselves at the highest level - albeit in the HL? I don't know...just seems like Webster doesn't fit the type of coach I was expecting the AD to search for. I may be wrong about that but again, with our current AD in place; we're in for a bunch of surprises! :confused:
Don't assume that the coaches you mentioned would actually take the job if offered.
Billeter will get his shot in D1....either this off-season or the next. He knows that. I bet he is on the short list at SDSU as we speak. He would feel no rush to jump at Milwaukee just BECAUSE it's D1...there is much going on that would make the D1 part sort of irrelevant. If he doesn't get SDSU, another school with less....um....baggage is sure to come calling.
The pool we dealt with was apparently quite limited....some of the imitations appeared to be by choice which irritates me to no end, but the vast majority of that limitation was due to the aforementioned "baggage" (read: dumpster fire).
This is what happens when you fire a respected coach simply because you - don't like him/didn't hire him/need to prove you have "big boy pants" on - without making a legitimate case to the right people BEFORE you do it. Those people get really pissed, and you end up having to pick from less than the best because you made a mess.
Pat Miller was not a candidate for our open position. Ask Amanda.
If you're Tom Billeter, why would you choose Milwaukee over SDSU? Money, maybe - we know the next coach will make considerably less than Rob Jeter.
Meaning that he didn't apply, or didn't show up on the consultant's radar?Quote:
Originally Posted by Jimmy Lemke
No and No.Quote:
Originally Posted by Skrapheap
Pat Miller applied AND showed up on the consultant's radar.
Well, then this is all just one big Bungle in the Jungle.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jimmy Lemke
-- signed Ian Anderson
Jimmy, any other updates on the names that have been floating around? I dont want to get a case of that awful foot in mouth disease...Quote:
Originally Posted by Jimmy Lemke
I always respect what you have to say BBF, but all you have to do is peruse Webster's rather limited Twitter account to see that his Badger ties are definitely there. You have also always been up front with your split loyalties, so I wouldn't expect for our concerns to be the same on the subject.Quote:
Originally Posted by BBF
I don't twit so would never see something like that. But really, what difference does it make? The only times Tracy Webster has been on the Madison campus the last 20 years have probably been as an opposing coach. With the exception of Howard Moore, he has no direct connection to anyone who has coached there since before Dick Bennett was hired. I get that some people don't want another coach out of the "Bo tree" (because that guy didn't know how to coach, I guess?) but Webster obviously is not. If anything he's out of the Gene Keady tree -- Bruce Weber, Matt Painter and Cuonzo Martin. I have no idea how good a coach Tracy will be if hired but I have tremendous respect for Keady and his disciples. They play tough, hard nosed, defensive basketball, but with a dash more playground flair and willingness to attack than you see in the Bennett and Bo styles. Which, by the way, is an almost exact description of how Rob Jeter coached, but let's not go there.
I'm with the people who don't want anyone from the Bo tree, but I obviously take it a step further. I would rather not have anyone with any ties to Madison, period. Plainly, I don't see how it can have a positive effect on the program.
We've already seen what having a dyed- in-the-wool Marquette Warrior (Ric Cobb, for those not aware) as head coach did to this program.
Ric Cobb had 7 years as an AAU coach and one as Antrim's assistant before he took over as head coach. Comparing him to an assistant who has been at Kentucky, Illinois, Purdue, Ball State, DePaul, Nebraska, Tennessee and Cal is just being unfair. He just pulled in a top 5 national recruiting class for 2015. That's incredible at Cal.Quote:
Originally Posted by MayorCK
One question remains....if he is so good, why so many stops along the way? Something strange about that...either he has some issues and has to move on, or worse yet, he is yet another job hopper who will be out of here at the first opportunity. Neither is good.
'hawk, don't kid yourself, no matter who we hire the chances are good that he'll leave in three or four years, either because he can, or because he's fired. That's the new normal. Short attention span theater.
The one lesson that I think everyone will take from our recent history is that we aren't going to handcuff ourselves with a big contract again. But there's a flip side to going with lowball contracts: it puts a mid-major program like ours in a terrible position to retain a coach we don't want to lose.
Well, Tennessee and Cal was with Cuonzo Martin.
I like Webster. Met him a few times, and seems like a great guy. And he was on campus within the last 20 years. But for the life of me, I have no idea why he would want to commit career suicide and step into this mess at Milwaukee. You guys might have reservations about him but he can definitely do better.
Most successful coaches will leave for greener pastures at 98% of programs. What we want is someone who is willing to stick around until one of the big boys come calling, and I'm not sure that is Webster (just based on his track record) . It's not a murderers row of candidates, but I can't blame a guy like Scott Nagy for not being interested, even in the best of situations, in Milwaukee. Why leave unless its for 4x the salary and a much bigger program? Build your program until the biggest of the big come calling. Guys like Frank Lickliter committed career suicide by leaving too early for a marginally bigger paycheck and bigger program (IMO), so build a winner until you get the call.
I wish we had someone with Milwaukee ties who was willing to grow with us. Maybe if Mark Pancratz didn't get out of coaching? But that candidate isn't out there, so hopefully we find someone determined to build a winner and move on when the time is right.
What track record? Well, I guess he is 1-15.
He does have that Marquette win to silence the haters with.Quote:
Originally Posted by dylanrocks
I guess until the University decides to take basketball seriously, this is what we will experience.
What will forever baffle me is how University Administrators can be so ignorant about the impact of athletics on their school. Either they are all egg heads who cannot fathom that sports is more popular in the general public than, say, a great debate team, or they do know but still don't care because prioritizing athletics in any way will make them persona non grata at the cocktail parties populated buy the Ivory Tower Elites.
Nothing publicizes a school more than winning in sports. Would Duke be a household name without basketball? An even better and more relevant example is Gonzaga.
Yet we still get stuck with Chancellors (with the lone exception of Zimpher, oh how I miss her) who think that the public at large has great interest in things like new academic programs and such, and look down their noses at athletics.
Sometimes I wish I would have gone to a school that took sports seriously so I wouldn't live with the constant frustration of a program doomed to mediocrity.
You know what is fair game? Why has he had so many different jobs? That's an incredibly unstable resume you just rattled off. 8 schools? Maybe that's not many if you're 60, but the guy is 44. I realize he went to Cal from Tennessee with Cuonzo, but what about all the other hopping around? It should be a red flag to anyone who has ever had to hire someone.
Addendum: I did not see Hawk's post at the top of this page when I posted this. He essentially said the same thing.
These are minor details.Quote:
Originally Posted by MayorCK